<?xml version='1.0' encoding='UTF-8'?><?xml-stylesheet href="http://www.blogger.com/styles/atom.css" type="text/css"?><feed xmlns='http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom' xmlns:openSearch='http://a9.com/-/spec/opensearchrss/1.0/' xmlns:georss='http://www.georss.org/georss'><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017</id><updated>2009-11-07T16:49:19.817-08:00</updated><title type='text'>Life Together</title><subtitle type='html'>Musings concerning life within the Christian community</subtitle><link rel='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005#feed' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/'/><link rel='hub' href='http://pubsubhubbub.appspot.com/'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email></author><generator version='7.00' uri='http://www.blogger.com'>Blogger</generator><openSearch:totalResults>5</openSearch:totalResults><openSearch:startIndex>1</openSearch:startIndex><openSearch:itemsPerPage>25</openSearch:itemsPerPage><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017.post-8708218953794768834</id><published>2008-09-29T18:50:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2008-09-29T19:34:04.947-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Jesus is the reason the parish exists</title><content type='html'>&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;span style="font-family:trebuchet ms;"&gt;"It is not to be taken for granted that the Christian has the privilege of living among other Christians.  Jesus Christ lived in the midst of his enemies.  At the end all his disciples deserted him.  On the Cross he was utterly alone, surrounded by evil doers and mockers...So the Christian, too, belongs...in the thick of foes." -- Bonhoeffer (Life Together)&lt;/span&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;The Christian community, the local parish, is God's gift to His children.  For the Christian, the congregation and its morning worship on Sunday is like the central fountain of the ancient town, a place to gather not only for life giving water but also for fellowship and renewal.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The Christian community is born of blood -- the blood of Christ.  I have served as pastor for several congregations and spoken with many Christians.  People would give me many different kinds of reasons for why they are in the church.  They like the style of worship, its location, they have friends there, the programs, even sometimes (though less often) the doctrine.  But in truth the individual parish exists first by the blood of Christ -- for He unites us together with all fellow believers.  And secondly the parish exists that we might be nurtured with the Gospel, the good news that announced to us in God's Word that our sin is forgiven and life eternal is to be had.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Monday through Friday I am reminded of how important the promise of God is for the reality of the human condition hits me in the face every single day.  No matter our creed, our race, our gender, or our politics we are all the same in the most important thing:  we die.  Right now my military assignment is ceremonial funerals at Arlington.  Every day - I honor the military service of someone who has died - usually a veteran who has lived a long life, sometimes an active duty death.  Death.  Reality.   Grace - what a wonder and a joy it is to hear in the face of reality that God promises something beyond - salvation through the cross of Jesus Christ.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;People flock together based on their similarities.  Congregations tend to develop a personality.  Conservative / liberal.  One race or another.  Even congregations with ethnic ministry and outreach tend to find that they have multiple services with those who feel "comfortable" with one another worshiping together.    Differences lead to competition, conflict, and so forth.  Differing values, different preferences -- conflict.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;These words of Bonhoeffer speak to me when I think about what leads people to unite and what also leads them into competition and conflict with one another:&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote style="font-family: trebuchet ms;"&gt;"One is my brother only through Jesus Christ.  I am a brother to another person through what Jesus Christ did for me and to me; the other person has become a brother to me through what Jesus Christ did for him.  Not what a man is in himself...what determines our brotherhood is what the man is by reason of Christ." -- Bonhoeffer (Life Together)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Before I ally myself with someone or a group of someones within the Church, or before I consider myself in competition or contradiction with someone or a group of someones - it is good for me to first remember who they are in Jesus Christ.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Now, I am not advocating a praxis of pure open ended toleration.  God's principles are His own.  Where He has spoken there is only room for preservation and keeping of that Word.   And where people have a disagreement over that Word, or dismiss that Word itself because it is too alien to our human way of life, then it is incumbent upon the faithful Christian and faithful congregation to recognize the contradiction.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Sadly a great deal of conflict within the parish is related to disagreement or even disbelief in God's clear Word.  There can be no answer to that except clear proclamation, patient teaching, and in the face of obstinate rejection - a recognition of cleavage of the fellowship.  But a great deal of conflict is also driven by human personality, experience, and preferences.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;It is an interesting dychotomoy that I have observed:  on clear principles of God's Word the people who claim Christ's name will argue and disagree because they are uncomfortable to practice.  But then people who claim Christ's name will take issues that Christ nor his disciples spoke too, issues that God allows us liberty in, and give to these practices a crucial go to war importance.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;A key principle I have always shared with my parishes.  This is Christ's house and it exists solely on the foundation of Christ's Word.  No Word - no house.  No Word - no Gospel.  No Word - no hope.  No Word - no reason for us to be here:  any old social club would do.  And Word means all of it.  Not the parts I like while ignoring the parts that are uncomfortable.   Not the parts that fit with our human sensibilities while dismissing or improving the parts we think obsolete.  Word - all of it.  As it is.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Word - if God has declared it - then we keep and preserve it. We cling to it for dear life.  For I believe if God took the trouble to speak it and have it recorded for us in the Scripture - it is important. And second God should know what he is talking about in regard to human life - since He created it.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But on the flip side - if God has not spoken - then there is certainly liberty - with responsibility.  Mission first.  The world is at war and I'm not talking about the War on Terror.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote style="font-family: trebuchet ms;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Eph 6:12  For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. &lt;/blockquote&gt;We are in a war.  Death comes to us all.  Victory comes only through the victory of Christ.  We see it only through the eyes of faith.  When I stand over the grave, with the body in a nice shiny casket about to go into a 12 foot deep hole to be marked by a stone, and I see the family that will depart never to see their loved one again upon this earth there is hope only in the promise of God.  Our parishes exist so that we may constantly hear and live within this hope.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;The Christian lives wholly by the truth of God's Word in Jesus Christ...the goal of all Christian community:  they meet one another as bringers of the message of salvation."  -- Bonhoeffer (Life Together)&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;Black, brown, or white... democrat, republican, independent, or apathetic...male or female...American or not...  as Christians we exist in a brother/sisterhood - not of death but of the promise of life united not by our own distinct bloodlines but by His blood.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;If we must have struggle, competition, even conflict - let it be only when necessary.  Let it be when the very foundation of our existence is at risk - when God's Word is challenged, dismissed, changed, or ignored.  Let it be when the very lifeblood of the Church is threatened because the promise of threatened because the truth is not kept.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Don't let it be over that which is truly not that important - the color of the carpet, will we buy the air conditioner, will we start a new worship service, or any other of a million things that are merely preference.  Nor let it be over slights and harsh words or taken offense.  Was the offense really intended?  And if so, was the offender so different from any of us - all born in sin -- all destined for the grave -- all in need of forgiveness - forgiveness of my Lord and forgivenss of my brother so I can come home.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the end isn't that what is important - to have hope in Christ - and a home and a family in which to find encouragment as we live out the realities of this life.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/8980096902700284017-8708218953794768834?l=churchlifetogether.blogspot.com'/&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/8708218953794768834/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8980096902700284017&amp;postID=8708218953794768834' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/8708218953794768834'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/8708218953794768834'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/2008/09/jesus-is-reason-parish-exists.html' title='Jesus is the reason the parish exists'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:extendedProperty xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' name='OpenSocialUserId' value='03905664413815909793'/></author><thr:total xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017.post-4901044989992896900</id><published>2008-09-28T08:19:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2008-09-28T08:26:20.731-07:00</updated><title type='text'>More Trouble with / for Pastors</title><content type='html'>&lt;span style="font-size:180%;"&gt;S&lt;/span&gt;unday before Memorial Day my phone rang in the evening.  It was a friend of mine who I had trained with who is a chaplain in the guard, who preaches at a smaller church in a place a lot more flat than where I am now. He was so very upset, because they had just cut his salary to the point that he can't afford to minister there any longer. It appears that in his case, one of the elders in his church has taken it upon himself to elevate his importance in the church's ministry by substituting himself into many of the roles that this pastor was doing and by doing all he can to point out the pastor's short comings. The elder in question was out visiting and praying with folks but also making sure to share the pastor's shortcomings that the elder believed in.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;He was wanting my input on whether to stick it out, what he could do to change their hearts, or whether to go onto active duty. The really sad thing is this is a man I would be honored to have as my pastor. Kind, faithful, and a down to earth kind of guy. There are lots of issues going on, but the truth is proclaiming God's Word flies in the face of some people, even some of those who belong to a church. It seems his trouble started when he counseled a couple living together that they should reconsider the nature of their relationship in the eyes of God. It isn't rocket science to understand the commandment against sexual relationships outside of marriage, but people sure find a powerful way of wrapping their applications around convenience. But pastoral art nears the complexity of rocket science when it comes to trying to engage in pastoral care of someone who has engaged in lifestyles contrary to God's Word when they are related to the movers and shakers in a congregation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Sad thing is, my counter for this website will tell me if people found this spot by searching for a specific topic. The most frequent topic that brings people here: trouble with their pastors.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Now why is that?&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Is it because pastors don't care about their people? Or is it because they care too much -- are willing to take a stand on the truth for their well-being? Is it because pastors like to offend people and be on the defensive? Is it because pastors want to tick people off and get them to leave the church so there is less money to pay their salary? Or could it have something to do with truth -- some who don't want it or need it? Could it also have to do with team? We talk about how pastors need to be leaders, but leaders need a team. True enough that I think all of us benefit from understanding people, leadership, and communication. But I also think too often something else is going on.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I guess I write this to my brother pastors, but also my brothers and sisters in the flock. Nothing hurts more than to give it your best go, and be blamed when the rains don't come or the soil is sandy, or the concerns of the world come and take away the efforts to plant fruit for God's kingdom. Nothing hurts more than to take a stand on the clear teaching of God's Word and to have one's character attacked because the stand was not popular or ran contrary to someone's lifestyle. And nothing hurts more than to have developed trust and respect for someone and then find them taking advantage of that relationship to undercut you while elevating themselves. It is especially hurtful and dissapointing when you invest so much hope and work into your people to find they are so much like everyone else.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;But our Lord reminds us, in your anger do not sin. The most obvious of course is not to give in and seek to return hurt for hurt. For pastors I wonder if sometimes it is also about knowing when it is a sin to remain in a situation where one will only be hurt. One may observe that Jesus didn't run and was willing to die for us. But then one has to balance this with those like Paul who knew when it was time to sneak out of town to minister to another group another day. Dying for a reason is one thing. Getting beat up for no reason is a different thing.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Brothers and sisters of the flock of God, I know there are those pastors who need to grow and there are those who need to go. But please don't too easily cast your pastor from the "grow" pile to the "go" pile. Just like families are there for one another to help each other grow, seek understanding and growth first. And check yourselves. Is the problem truly that your pastor doesn't care, is lazy, mean, or incompetent, or is it that God's Word is stretching you beyond your comfort zone as God seeks to have you grow. If you have a mean spirited hateful pastor, the church is ready to act. If only the same resolve were there when the mean spirit was found in rabid sheep. It can happen. So before you jump to conclusions about the pastor in trouble, look at everything going on, and again talk to him. Find out if he cares, what he cares about, what he thinks about what is going on, and why he is conducting himself as he is. It could be eye opening.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My brother was sharing with me that he kept thinking that he should just turn the other cheek and keep on keeping on. But then I recall this powerful article "Clergy Killers". There are some people, and some groups of people, who get something out of tearing down the very people they call to shepherd them. The article says alot. I think anyone who has trouble with their pastor or who has a pastor in trouble, should read it -- just as a check. I'm not saying pastors are perfect. But I think too often God's people expect them to be miracle workers or people pleasers when in truth they are men called by God to proclaim God's Word as it is written and to minister to people the best they can where they are with what they have to work with.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;The article is here:  &lt;a href="http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/8591.htm"&gt;http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/8591.htm&lt;/a&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Here is a teaser quote for you : "&lt;span class="textArticleDetail"&gt;  &lt;p&gt;"Clergy killers are masters of disguise. They can present themselves as pious, active church members who are "only doing this for the good of the church." Naive and gentle ("peace at all costs") parishioners may be deceived by such camouflage. And they typically advocate for the CKs (Clergy Killers) by urging the pastor and church board to be patient, make allowances, or not to misjudge such folks. CKs can convince many that they are raising legitimate issues. And for those who might do battle with them, CKs use bluster, threats, and even terrorism to appear as unstoppable giants. CKs even have allies of opportunity, i.e., parishioners who do not advocate the cause CKs are espousing, but who wish to punish the pastor for their own hidden reasons."(by G. Lloyd Rediger, PhD Directory of Clergy Counseling Services, Wisconsin Council of Churches August 1993 +The Clergy Journal)&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div style="text-align: right;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:85%;"&gt;(reprinted from my blog "Shepherd's Ponderings")&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:180%;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/8980096902700284017-4901044989992896900?l=churchlifetogether.blogspot.com'/&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/4901044989992896900/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8980096902700284017&amp;postID=4901044989992896900' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/4901044989992896900'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/4901044989992896900'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/2008/09/more-trouble-with-for-pastors.html' title='More Trouble with / for Pastors'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:extendedProperty xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' name='OpenSocialUserId' value='03905664413815909793'/></author><thr:total xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017.post-527237271532926223</id><published>2008-09-28T08:11:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2008-09-28T08:25:40.308-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Problem with your pastor</title><content type='html'>&lt;span style="font-size:180%;"&gt;F&lt;/span&gt;rom time to time I get questions through my website &lt;a href="http://www.lutheran-resources.org/"&gt;Lutheran-resources.org&lt;/a&gt; concerning various aspects of church and ministry. I received a phone call this evening from someone up north of me who laid out a problem that I thought one aspect of would be worth responding to here. He described the situation to be one of conflict between their young pastor and a number of members of the congregation. It would appear that the pastor's practice is not what some members of the congregation expect. The gentleman who contacted me is an elder in the congregation and wanted some advice considering the following. These group of people upset with the pastor have begun have meetings together outside the church with the express purpose of garnering support to encourage the pastor to leave. He said that when some of these members are asked what the problem is the answer tends to be a disagreement with this paricular major church practice and other "personal issues" with the pastor. He also shared that of the members in question, some are coming to church and some are not. The majority of the members who are upset with this pastor have not met with him or talked to him nor will they air their specific grievances with him. The elder shared frustration that these members are already convinced the pastor is closed minded and does not care about them and they just want him to leave.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My advice to him was he should speak with the pastor and maybe he and the pastor should consult their circuit counselor. But I do have some advice to those out there who may feel frustrated with their pastor or upset with their pastor.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I think every pastor has had his share of people in the parish who were not pleased with something about his ministry. After all pastors are not perfect and we make our share of mistakes. We make judgment calls which with 20/20 hindsight we might now do differently. Sometimes we are all too human. At this point I think Matthew 18 has some serious applications. Our Lord instructed us that when we have a problem with someone we should go talk to them in an effort to resolve it. If it is not resolvable at that level, then we take an elder or other official to speak with the person again to resolve the issue. I would suggest that any action to just get someone out or that does not involve speaking with the pastor to try to resolve the issue is likely not God-pleasing. The goal in Matthew 18 for Jesus was to "win the brother". If one's goal is different in dealing with problems in the church, whether the pastor or someone else, I think the course of action should be reconsidered in careful prayer. I truly believe that many problems between pastors and parishioners could be more easily settled if the parishioner would talk with the pastor rather than clam up, leave, or utilize the gossip vine to attack the pastor's reputation or motives.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Perhaps it is difficult to share with a pastor that one has a problem with something he has done. Maybe the pastor has made a mistake and needs to have it pointed out so that he can repent, ask for forgiveness, and learn from the mistake. But perhaps the pastor is doing what he is supposed to do. I have seen parish boards who considered the pastor to work for them and wanted to manage his every action. I have always reminded my church councils and boards that the pastor and the members labor for the Lord together. Our accountability is not just to one another, but to Him. Sometimes a pastor's pastoral care is determined not by his experience or even his preferences but by the command of God in Scripture. Pastors are described by Scripture as stewards of the mysteries of God and that they will one day be called to give an account of that stewardship. If you disagree with a pastor's practice which is a reflection of doctrine, this is most certainly a time to talk to him. But in these matters, God's Word must have the final word. Could the pastor be wrong? Sure. Any pastor worth his salt will also confess that God's Word must have the final word and if his practice is demonstrated to be in error, will be willing to change it. But the pastor could also be right. In fact, in matters of doctrine and practice derived from doctrine, the pastor should have the theological training to make the correct decisions, especially concerning major practices of the church.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;What about "personal issues" with the pastor? If this is lingo for "private issues" which one plans to use to justify either not coming to church or taking inappropriate action to force a pastor to move on, the I would suggest that issues, whether "personal issues" or "private issues" should be reconsidered in light of Matthew 18. Here personal does not justify secret, private or behind the scenes political maneuverings. Secret political maneuverings behind the scene to destroy the reputation of an individual or a pastor's ministry in a place or even a church leaders ministry  do not testify well to the light that Christians are supposed to be in the world. The goal is "to win the brother". Only when every last effort to win the brother has been exhausted and it is clearly provable from God's Word that the brother is in error, can he be treated as a tax collector and shunned. It seems to me the shunning comes way to early in too many cases, cases that could be resolved for the good of all and the growth of church and kingdom, but in the end wind up only causing hurt and discontent because "personal issues" was lingo for "private issues" and I don't want to consider the pastor could be right and I could be wrong. True the pastor could be wrong. Any pastor worth his salt will be willing to examine his practice and beliefs in light of God's Word and be willing to admit it if he is wrong. Actually, any Christian, worth his or her salt should be willing to do the same. If the pastor is correctly interpreting and applying God's Word, he must not deviate and he must teach, with the same goal in mind -- win the brother.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;One more thing I would note, as this particular dispute that set me to ruminating was concerning a major church practice. If the pastor is practicing in such a way that he is in line with the expectations of his wider church community, his faith tradition, or his church body of which the congregation is a part, is it truly honorable or a position of integrity to expect the pastor to practice something other -- to pretend to honor a common expectation but to practice something else even if it might be more popular or less offensive. Sometimes standing for something, especially the truth of God's Word, can be isolating and unpopular, especially in a fallen unChristian world. Maybe the church body is wrong. Truth must always win out. But in all things there should be genuiness. Integrity. If you have a problem with a pastor's practice -- tell him. Learn why he does it and share with him why you disagree. Maybe one or both of you will learn something. But don't pretend to want to win your brother when you really just want your own way. Don't pretend concern when it is lacking. Don't justify worldly behavior that seeks only to serve oneself with "personal issues". And don't expect your pastor to just pay lip service to his vows, his allegiance to God's Word, or to his conscience. Do trust, that if he cares enough to dedicate his life to the long course of education to prepare for the ministry and to make the sacrifices necessary for the ministry, that he will care enough to listen and explain why, and if he finds he is wrong, to change. To clam up, leave, and or maneuver to isolate the man does not honor what the church should be. To communicate, to seek understanding, to humble oneself before the truth of God's Word, this does honor to the Church and to its Lord.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;So in a nutshell -- if you have a problem with your pastor -- talk to the man. Don't shut him out. Don't lock it up inside and certainly don't use your problem to justify sinful and destructive behavior. Be genuine. Don't pretend as if there is no problem on one hand and work against him on the other. Certainly don't restort to gossip or secret meetings with the purpose to utilize surprise and power politics and pretend you are doing the Lord's work. Do talk and seek mutual understanding. And if you and your pastor need some help resolving the issue then seek out assistance. In the case of the LCMS, I have utilized my circuit counselor and even my District President to help resolve issues, especially big ones that relate to a church's major practices. Finally, the more certain you are that you are right, the more you should be willing to listen. Maybe you are missing something. Maybe your pastor knows what he is about. Maybe you are the one who is in error. Or maybe you both are. The goal in the end is faithfulness to the Word of Life and to be sure we are all won by the Holy Spirit to the truth that is found in Christ Jesus. This is truly the win / win situation.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;In the worst case scenario, where you just can't see eye to eye, be a person of honor and integrity. If the pastor is faithfully reflecting the church or denomination he belongs to, respect that. If you don't agree with those positions, then don't pretend to be what you are not and seek to gain control of that congregation to force your will upon it. Have more honor than that. If you truly don't support your church's position, then admit that and decide if you can live with it or not. If not, don't seek to turn to turn the church into something that gives lip service to its identity. Maybe for the peace of your own conscience you will have to seek out another church home. That is certainly more honorable than secret meetings, gossip, emails, phone calls, and so forth to push out a pastor who is faithfully ministering according to his vows. If the pastor is out of line, and a personal confrontation is not sufficient to change his practice, then his ecclesiastical supervisor will deal with it -- and this is Matthew 18. If his supervisor and the doctrines and practices of the church at large support his practice -- then I believe the only honorable thing to do, if one truly cannot support that practice in good conscience, is to join another congregation that does practice in line with your conscience. However, one should do his or her homework first, that is only after being convinced by God's Word. You could be wrong. The pastor could be wrong. The whole denomination could be wrong. But the Word is never wrong.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Recommended reading:  "&lt;a href="http://jmm.aaa.net.au/articles/8591.htm"&gt;Clergy Killers&lt;/a&gt;"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;div style="text-align: right;"&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:78%;"&gt;(reprinted from my blog "Shepherd's Ponderings")&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;span style="font-size:180%;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/8980096902700284017-527237271532926223?l=churchlifetogether.blogspot.com'/&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/527237271532926223/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8980096902700284017&amp;postID=527237271532926223' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/527237271532926223'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/527237271532926223'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/2008/09/problem-with-your-pastor.html' title='Problem with your pastor'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:extendedProperty xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' name='OpenSocialUserId' value='03905664413815909793'/></author><thr:total xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017.post-3065354223912100645</id><published>2008-09-27T10:53:00.000-07:00</published><updated>2008-09-27T11:03:37.918-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Christian Community is about Jesus</title><content type='html'>Much that is wrong inside congregations comes from folks loosing sight of the main thing: the house is the Lord's.    The following words from Bonheoffer's Life Together express the heart of Christian community.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div style="text-align: center;"&gt;&lt;div style="text-align: justify;"&gt;"Christianity means community through Jesus Christ and in Jesus Christ. No Christian community is more or less than this."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"...a Christian needs others because of Jesus Christ...a Christian comes to others only through Jesus Christ."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"First, the Christian is the man who no longer seeks his salvation, his deliverance, his justification in himself but in Jesus Christ alone...He lives wholly by God's Word pronounced upon him...But God has put His word into the mouth of men in order that it may be communicated to other men."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"...the goal of all Christian community:  they meet one another as bringers of the message of salvation."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;div style="text-align: center;"&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"Second, a Christian comes to others only through Jesus Christ...Without Christ there is discord between God and man and between man and man...Thus God has taught us to meet one another as God has met us in Christ."&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;"&lt;br /&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/8980096902700284017-3065354223912100645?l=churchlifetogether.blogspot.com'/&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/3065354223912100645/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8980096902700284017&amp;postID=3065354223912100645' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/3065354223912100645'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/3065354223912100645'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/2008/09/christian-community-is-about-jesus.html' title='Christian Community is about Jesus'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:extendedProperty xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' name='OpenSocialUserId' value='03905664413815909793'/></author><thr:total xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'>0</thr:total></entry><entry><id>tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8980096902700284017.post-1176806356757397355</id><published>2008-09-27T08:51:00.001-07:00</published><updated>2008-09-27T09:04:01.809-07:00</updated><title type='text'>Why</title><content type='html'>Why this collection of musings?  As a pastor in the Christian community and as webmaster of Lutheran-resources.org, I have had numerous conversations in person and through the internet with laity and pastors who have struggled with their lives together:  pastor with church, church folks with other church folks, and Christian folk with non-Christian folk.  I posted a couple of comments about conflict between pastors and laity a few years back on my other blog (Shepherd's Ponderings).  I find that these posts are the most frequently searched out pages of any I have put on the internet.  So... I thought here to offer a collection of thoughts (from myself and others) that will help folks give consideration to their lives together within Christian community. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;My primary focus is more on the micro level than the macro level.  For instance, my concern is not so much to address relations between denominations or different faiths but rather the relations of folks with folks within their church and their own individual communities. &lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;Please feel free to respond to any post you find here.  And if you find resources or links out there that you find helpful and inspiring for our lives together in our Christian communities please feel free to share them.&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;I don't claim to be an end all expert.  I have had experiences which I will share.  I have mentors, some I know and some I read, who inspire me.  And I hope to receive wisdom as we journey together and you offer comments.&lt;div class="blogger-post-footer"&gt;&lt;img width='1' height='1' src='https://blogger.googleusercontent.com/tracker/8980096902700284017-1176806356757397355?l=churchlifetogether.blogspot.com'/&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</content><link rel='replies' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/feeds/1176806356757397355/comments/default' title='Post Comments'/><link rel='replies' type='text/html' href='https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=8980096902700284017&amp;postID=1176806356757397355' title='0 Comments'/><link rel='edit' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/1176806356757397355'/><link rel='self' type='application/atom+xml' href='http://www.blogger.com/feeds/8980096902700284017/posts/default/1176806356757397355'/><link rel='alternate' type='text/html' href='http://churchlifetogether.blogspot.com/2008/09/why.html' title='Why'/><author><name>Shepherd</name><uri>http://www.blogger.com/profile/08034125633557257139</uri><email>noreply@blogger.com</email><gd:extendedProperty xmlns:gd='http://schemas.google.com/g/2005' name='OpenSocialUserId' value='03905664413815909793'/></author><thr:total xmlns:thr='http://purl.org/syndication/thread/1.0'>0</thr:total></entry></feed>